Message 1 From: "vainer44" <vainer44@y...> Date: Thu Jul 15, 2004 7:25 pm Subject: hello test ...test...
Message 2 From: "vainer44" <vainer44@y...> Date: Fri Jul 16, 2004 6:50 pm Subject: only 3 members so far? ...I thought this would take off...
Message 3 From: "Edwin Yang" <edwinyang@h...> Date: Fri Jul 16, 2004 8:38 pm Subject: RE: [sunriseandsunset] only 3 members so far? ...Give'em time.
Message 12 From: "Jen Woyan" <jwoyan@c...> Date: Sun Jul 18, 2004 12:54 am Subject: Re: [sunriseandsunset] hello all/ending ...We choose the safer, less difficult path ~ isn't that the crux of what Jesse and Celine wrangle with in the car back to her flat? They acknowledge to one another their weaknesses and fears - not necessarily looking for the other to understand or accept or fix their 'issues' - they just feel so incredibly relieved to voice these fears to another human being at all. It is something that I believe they would never imagine sharing with their current 'partners' - too frightening. So their choice, while necessary, would be incredibly profound for not just themselves, but all the ancillary persons they touch each day.
Message 13 From: tietableguy@y... Date: Sun Jul 18, 2004 1:58 am Subject: Re: hello all/ending ...i think they're both willing to work on their relationship, but will they end up together? I don't know and here's why: Jesse loves his son, and divorce would end at least half of his time with him. Celine is commitment-phobic, and any long-term relationship with her is an iffy chance at best.
Message 14 From: "Edwin Yang" <edwinyang@h...> Date: Sun Jul 18, 2004 4:29 am Subject: Re: [sunriseandsunset] hello all/ending ...I loved getting caught off-guard. I walked in knowing the movie was only 80 minutes, and hating the fact I knew that. I was so sure it would finish before it began; I thought that was it when they got off the boat and met the limo.
Message 19 From: "Edwin Yang" <edwinyang@h...> Date: Mon Jul 19, 2004 4:14 pm Subject: RE: [sunriseandsunset] he says "Celine" ...They shake hands - I love that, because that is what happens when strangers really connect - the first conversation happens, then the introductions.
Message 20 From: Danial Monckton <vainer44@y...> Date: Mon Jul 19, 2004 5:30 pm Subject: RE: [sunriseandsunset] Re: hello all/ending ...What did I think of the ending? I loved it. I could not believe that that was the end when I first saw it. I was thinking how could they end it like this. But after I saw it the second time I realized it was perfect.
Message 31 From: "Chen-yu \(Jenny\), Chen" <chenche5@m...> Date: Tue Jul 20, 2004 2:57 am Subject: Re: [sunriseandsunset] Audience reaction ...I guess guys feel it funny because Celine was being neurotic and emotional in her cute french way, but to me, a woman at her late 20s, that scene was not THAT funny. It was sad, because it was brutally real. It was like no matter how successful/ independent she is, there was still something missing... and the thing that is missing, could be her "real" connection with Jesse.
Message 32 From: tietableguy@y... Date: Tue Jul 20, 2004 5:33 am Subject: Re: Audience reaction ...i'm a male in my mid-30's and i agree: that whole scene was heart-rending. Celine is truly heartsick at (for lack of a better term) "always a bridesmaid, never a bride" and anyone who actually thought about it would realize how terrible it is to be in that position.
Message 39 From: "Allison" <clasikfanatik@y...> Date: Tue Jul 20, 2004 1:35 pm Subject: oh the sadness! ...Anyway, as for the first movie, Before Sunrise, I first saw it when I was 14 and adored it! People always seem to talk about how this movie would only make an impact on you if you were around the same age as the characters but for me, the overall message regarding the existence of human connections was powerful enough that although I had yet to experience the emotions felt by the characters, I was still able to connect with them.
Message 45 From: "jerseybucsfan" <mayda-barry@p...> Date: Tue Jul 20, 2004 4:12 pm Subject: Re: Audience reaction ...The key to any relationship is balance. If you love another person more than they love you, you're probably doomed. If the reverse is true, then they probably are. I think Celine and Jesse work as a pair because they are emotionally in the same place.
Message 47 From: Suncana <suncana76@y...> Date: Tue Jul 20, 2004 5:31 pm Subject: Re: [sunriseandsunset] Before Sunset Trailer ... I feel so melancholic right now...Almost as if my "other self" is actually living the life I imagine in beautiful Vienna at this very moment... I don't know why, but I have always been tied to Vienna in a very weird (perhaps karmic?) way. Before Sunrise enhances this tie, as it is one of my favourite movies.
Message 51 From: "mittenkg" <mittenkg@y...> Date: Wed Jul 21, 2004 12:21 am Subject: Re: say hello? ...As far as Celine's line about knowing she'd have sex with Jesse as soon as she got off the train, that line rang as true to me as any other. I've definitely known when I was going to have sex with a guy that early--almost every time in fact. (That's why we sit next to them in trains! ha-ha--please don't read this any psychos/stalkers) Most of what Celine says in the film sounded so true to me, even if I saw myself as a silly idiot in her words. Like she said, Why do we have to make everything so complicated?
Message 52 From: "Yang-Ming" <r89227010@n...> Date: Wed Jul 21, 2004 1:08 am Subject: Re: say hello? ...I saw "Before Sunrise" for the first time when I was a freshman in college. It's when I became addicted to watching movies especially those non-blockbusters. I guess I'd kind of weird for this but I just don't regard movie as pure entertainment. I was hoping something more than that. The synopsis of "Before Sunrise" attracted my attention and I joined some classmates to see that movie. I just LOVE it so much. I wished to have similar encounter like Jessie. Having the chance to discuss issues about life not just love related matters. About an year later, I got the chance to travel in Europe by train but things didn't happen as planned :p However, I did make some new friends and had couple pleasant chats throughout the trip.
Message 54 From: "mike" <mike.email@g...> Date: Wed Jul 21, 2004 5:37 am Subject: Re: say hello? ...what would you do if you are married with a child and meet your biggest love in life again??? Is it better to divorce and risk to see your child only at weekend, but live together with your biggest love? It seems to me that you can't really say what's wrong or right in this context. What do you think about it?
Message 57 From: Suncana <suncana76@y...> Date: Wed Jul 21, 2004 1:50 pm Subject: Re: [sunriseandsunset] Re: say hello? ...Then, there was something about the honesty and raw emotion during that car scene in particular that has brought me to a place of reflection and meditation about my own life. I am now trying to figure out where I am headed and where I would like to be... And, like Celine, will the memory of one love and the "what if?" prevent me from fully letting go with someone else ... I haven't been the same since I've seen it...
Message 61 From: Jill Lee <jillannalee@y...> Date: Thu Jul 22, 2004 12:10 am Subject: Re: [sunriseandsunset] Re: oh the sadness! ...I think Before Sunset opens up a new beginning. I love how it ends; it still leaves so much hope and so much of the dream; although I think this time around, it's more realistic. I felt that Before Sunrise idealized a serendipitous encounter with the "one" at its best. However in Before Sunset, Jesse and Celine had this connection and relationship that seemed more human and less 'fairy tale-like'. You still see the happiness, hope, and love they have for each other that I can somehow feel in the end, that, they will be okay.
Message 64 From: "jerseybucsfan" <mayda-barry@p...> Date: Thu Jul 22, 2004 2:10 am Subject: Re: Celine's excuse ...after looking at the photos (Celine's apartment) Jesse is loving her even more, as he gets to absorb in, the details of nine years of imagination; hence he reaches for the music... The choice of songs Just in Time are not coincidental; seemingly nothing in the script is. She came back into his life 'just in time,' bringing back a beautiful part of his soul before it died. They won't let the second chance get away.
Message 67 From: "Edwin Yang" <edwinyang@h...> Date: Thu Jul 22, 2004 3:04 am Subject: RE: [sunriseandsunset] Re: Celines excuse ...how jarring it must have been for Jesse to see where Celine lives. Up until then, this girl had only existed in that one night in Vienna, and 9 years of thinking about her and idealizing her since. Now, all of a sudden she has walls of reality surrounding the two of them.
Message 70 From: Jill Lee <jillannalee@y...> Date: Thu Jul 22, 2004 11:24 am Subject: RE: [sunriseandsunset] Re: Celine's excuse ...Maybe I just want to stay naive of the fact that it's possible... But I also just want to believe that Jesse and Celine really had something for each other the moment the first words came out of them, in the train to Vienna.
Message 81 From: "josephine_1014" <josephine_1014@y...> Date: Thu Jul 22, 2004 5:08 pm Subject: Jesse's Book ...In reference to Jesse's book...I wonder to whom it was dedicated? I wish it were really available for purchase!
Message 86 From: "Jeremy Zorn" <jeremyzorn@c...> Date: Thu Jul 22, 2004 5:22 pm Subject: RE: [sunriseandsunset] Which is the better movie? ...the scene in the car was one of the most raw and "dramatic" that I've ever seen.
Message 88 From: "Chen-Yu Chen" <chenche5@m...> Date: Thu Jul 22, 2004 5:52 pm Subject: Re: Which is the better movie? ...Knowing the story didn't end up there on that platform nine years ago, and that they have a second chance to rekindle their love, it just makes me happy and content (btw, the day they were supposed to meet is my birthday!)
Message 93 From: Suncana <suncana76@y...> Date: Thu Jul 22, 2004 6:27 pm Subject: Re: [sunriseandsunset] Which is the better movie? ...I like the second movie better only because I find the characters more exposed. They're more aware of "life" and the fact that it doesn't stop for anyone, even those with a true soul connection. Before Sunrise has become the dream-world and Before Sunset is the reality we face.
Message 95 From: Ali <mittenkg@y...> Date: Thu Jul 22, 2004 6:29 pm Subject: Re: [sunriseandsunset] Suicide? ...What a pain for the filmmaker, to have test/canned versions of the film accidentally distributed to the press. I love Before Sunset as-is, so I'm glad Linklater canned the suicide scars shot. Whether Celine attempted suicide or not isn't necessarily relevant to their connection, but I suppose it's relevant to why the night would have meant so much to her.
Message 98 From: Suncana <suncana76@y...> Date: Thu Jul 22, 2004 6:39 pm Subject: Re: [sunriseandsunset] Foundation of a relationship ...Sex is not the premise of either of these two films. I believe Linklater wanted to show that sex is secondary (almost a bonus) to a true soul connection. By the time Celine and Jesse did "the deed", they were connected on a deeper level than that of the typical 'one night stand'.
Message 103 From: "Allison" <clasikfanatik@y...> Date: Thu Jul 22, 2004 6:53 pm Subject: Re: Foundation of a relationship ...you only had to look at how heartbroken they were at the parting scene at the train station; to see the deep connection they had with each other that went beyond a mere one-night tryst... didn't you just loved the long gaze they kept on exchanging at the plaza the morning after? It's so indicative of how their feelings for each other had evolved over the few hours they spent together...it was magical...
Message 109 From: "hiroshiupshur" <hiroshiupshur@y...> Date: Thu Jul 22, 2004 10:39 pm Subject: Foundation ...it was about communication. It was about being truthful and open.
Message 110 From: "Jeremy Zorn" <jeremyzorn@c...> Date: Thu Jul 22, 2004 10:47 pm Subject: Re: [sunriseandsunset] Foundation ...They connected mentally, so they talked for 14 hours. They connected physically, so they had sex.
Message 112 From: "jerseybucsfan" <mayda-barry@p...> Date: Fri Jul 23, 2004 12:21 am Subject: Re: Foundation ...Jesse speaks about marrying because of his higher self but he hasn't been honest with himself. His higher self is with Celine. A love on this level can only bring out our best. The connection that these two have spiritually is on a far different plane (than mere lust). The pain that they have experienced is a reflection of nothing else measuring up to the apex of their euphoria for those 14 hours. It's almost a sacred thing.
Message 113 From: Jill Lee <jillannalee@y...> Date: Fri Jul 23, 2004 12:46 am Subject: Re: [sunriseandsunset] Foundation of a relationship ...IF there weren't any feelings or connection between Celine and Jesse. Why write a book about it?... Why dream about her?... Why think about each other?... Why seek each other out?...
Message 114 From: "jerseybucsfan" <mayda-barry@p...> Date: Fri Jul 23, 2004 1:02 am Subject: Re: Foundation of a relationship ...The case for being cautious is when relationships are being dealt with, on a lower karmic level, which is to say less about spiritual bond, cohesion, compatibility and more about instant gratification. How long does it take to love someone or something? I suppose that varies for everyone. I've had a few cases in life where I loved something or someone instantaneously.... If you don't take a chance, you can never reach that higher plane.
Message 116 From: tietableguy@y... Date: Fri Jul 23, 2004 2:48 am Subject: Re: Foundation of a relationship ...the most important thing of all: if only one person in the relationship is working on it, it won't last. That's why I'm not sure where Jesse and Celine will end up: I'd like to see them stay together, but there are hard choices for both to make.
Message 118 From: "edwinpyang" <edwinyang@h...> Date: Fri Jul 23, 2004 6:16 am Subject: Jesse's book and Celine's song ...I would like to say that Jesse writing a whole book as a means for finding Celine is possibly the most romantic gesture I've ever heard of. I suppose another way to go would have been to write a song about that night in Vienna...(as Celine does). Anybody would be so lucky to spend 14 hours that good, vibrant, and life-affirming with another person in a whole lifetime.
Message 119 From: "edwinpyang" <edwinyang@h...> Date: Fri Jul 23, 2004 6:33 am Subject: lyrics to A Waltz For A Night ...I think Celine's song is the single most romantic ACTUAL MOMENT that we see in either film. I've never seen a character more vulnerable than when she pauses and blurts out the name "Jesse".
Message 120 From: "Aidan" <oranje68@h...> Date: Fri Jul 23, 2004 7:06 am Subject: Movie Review 1.- ...I would not be surprised if Ethan's brilliant novel "The Hottest State" was not partly written with half an eye to reconciling his own past. The male autobiographical novel is often confessional, helplessly romantic and ultimately impossible 'the big intense love' that many men have somewhere before the age of 23-- that just cannot be equaled until you have your first child. 2.- ...They froze the night in time and immortalized it by not allowing real life to rot at the edges of the memory. What they had, was not love because love is something that also knows bad times when your partner may not always be so perfect.
Message 121 From: Allison <clasikfanatik@y...> Date: Fri Jul 23, 2004 9:54am Subject: Re: The uncertainty of whether they had sex (Before Sunrise) ...Did anyone notice that when they show the flashbacks at the end of the movie and when they show the grass where they made love, that there is an empty wine bottle where they were? C&J are litterbugs!!
Message 124 From: hiroshi upshur <hiroshiupshur@y...> Date: Fri Jul 23, 2004 10:29am Subject: Re: Movie Review ...I am the only one here that was concerned with the state of his wife. He has a wife and we all feel for Celine and Jesse - but what about his wife? What about her boyfriend ? I said I can't and one should not come to a final conclusion until we hear from them .
Message 125 From: hiroshi upshur <hiroshiupshur@y...> Date: Fri Jul 23, 2004 10:39am Subject: Re: Jesse's book and Celine's song ...As some famous poet once said - "Love is NOT A FEELING to be heard."
Message 133 From: jerri willmore <colouringpurple@y...> Date: Fri Jul 23, 2004 2:53pm Subject: Re: Re: Foundation of a relationship ...I think we all have ideals :/ The most important thing is people caring about each other. Thank you for all your thoughts.
Message 150 From: john griffiths <john.griffiths@g...> Date: Fri Jul 23, 2004 5:03pm Subject: Re: Re: message board ? ...one new recruit here...hello all - just saw BS today as it was only released in the UK today....absolutely stunned....everything I wanted from it, and more -
Message 151 From: Danial Monckton <vainer44@y...> Date: Fri Jul 23, 2004 5:06pm Subject: Re: Re: message board ? ...Here come the English. (See prior message)
Message 152 From: john griffiths <john.griffiths@g...> Date: Fri Jul 23, 2004 5:11pm Subject: Re: Re: message board ? >>>>>Here come the english>>>> ...and the Scottish :-) (see prior message)
Message 155 From: samantha <samantha@s...> Date: Fri Jul 23, 2004 8:13pm Subject: Re: Ok people ...Anyway, there's lots of great lines in Sunrise, but I think the best is when Celine tells her friend on the phone that Jesse kind of kisses like an adolescent, and he's insulted, and she's amused. But my favorite moment is void of dialogue -- the listening booth. As for Sunset, Celine's outburst in the limo breaks my heart and inspires me over and over again. Delpy is so fantastic in the sequel.
Message 156 From: Ali <mittenkg@y...> Date: Fri Jul 23, 2004 8:35pm Subject: Re: Re: The uncertainty of whether they had sex (Before Sunrise) ...So, in essence, that, to me, is the significance of the wine bottle and glasses left behind. It shows that Jesse and Celine WERE there, it really did happen, this wasn't just a dream. Could this also be the purpose of having a tottering old lady walk past their place of consummation? I always thought she served as a juxtaposition between young, impulsive love and the steady purposefulness of the elderly. But maybe her presence has greater symbolism? She might represent the passing of time, the gray area between dreaming and reality or maybe she's just a nod to Celine's thoughts about being an old woman.
Message 159 From: Ali <mittenkg@y...> Date: Fri Jul 23, 2004 9:08pm Subject: Re: Ok people ...I also agree with Sam that a favorite line is from Celine describing Jesse kissing like an adolescent. I also like how she calls him clumsy--that's the first (only) time I've ever heard that word used endearingly, and it's the perfect word to describe him. And the entire limousine eyelash poem--I SWOONED the first time I heard that cute bum read it! (who IS that actor?)
Message 162 From: jerseybucsfan <mayda-barry@p...> Date: Fri Jul 23, 2004 9:19pm Subject: The irony of convincing Celine to get off the train ...Is anyone else struck by the remarkable irony of the dialogue in the first film whereupon Jesse convinces Celine to get off the train with him? Picture yourself married 20 years from now, but your marriage doesn't have that same spark. I'm just as boring...etc. In reality, she didn't get married and the scenario he presents more represents HIM. But instead of him not being anything special, he in fact is the best thing that ever happened to her. So while he's selling the go-with-the-flow, it's-not-a-big-deal mentality, in fact it IS a big deal, maybe the most important choice she'll ever make romantically...until, of course, they don't exchange phone numbers!
Message 166 From: kristel pizon <kedp317@y...> Date: Fri Jul 23, 2004 10:25pm Subject: Re: lasting love ...I was thinking today about the first night my husband and i spent together, talking, and sharing and falling in love. It was a wonderful night and I think if it had been our only night he definitely would have been the one that got away, the person i would think about for the rest of my life, what if.... Instead we got married, 4 kids, a house, stress, love and pain, etc... you know the drill and now, though I love him still, much of the time we are just surviving this whole life thing, so i think in fact Jesse and Celine have a much better chance at their love lasting on a deep level, because they are meeting now instead of Dec. 16th. Now they know what it is like to live a life without each other, and i think their love is deeper because of it. Had they dated in their 20's the depth of love would not have been as substantial simply because they would never have experienced an existence without it. Voici mes penses pour se soir...
Message 167 From: jerseybucsfan <mayda-barry@p...> Date: Fri Jul 23, 2004 10:32pm Subject: Re: lasting love ...What if Celine had gotten his number and didn't call anyway? What if she tracked him down via the Internet three or four years later? What if he was on the way to his wedding, saw the person he thought was Celine, stopped and it was? Would he have called off the wedding right then and there? As you well know, there are commitment people" people who can devote their whole heart and mind to a relationship after only knowing the other a short while. They CHOOSE to do so and invest that energy. Some people spend years together and never give much of anything. So I don't buy the rationalistic arguments about age, responsibility, etc. Yes, there are those who live off many one-night stands. But some people really are willing to put everything on the line for a loving energy on another level. When two of those people meet, that rare instance, incredible magic can occur. That's why we love these movies. We believe in magic.
Message 169 From: jerseybucsfan <mayda-barry@p...> Date: Fri Jul 23, 2004 10:51pm Subject: Re: lasting love ...Watching Jesse throughout this second movie, while he mostly remains more stoic than Celine-- he definitely looks more weathered IMHO. Not living the dream has taxed him. She can always tell herself that on Dec. 16 he probably wasn't there anyway (until this moment). But he knew she wasn't there. And that is far more disillusioning than anything else. He says he forgives her, but until she actually shows up at the bookstore, my guess is that deep down, she really has wounded him to the point of accepting a lot less in life. She sought more in life-- and didn't find it. It's really two different kinds of frustration.
Message 171 From: jerseybucsfan <mayda-barry@p...> Date: Fri Jul 23, 2004 11:08pm Subject: Re: lasting love ...You must not only find The One, but be The One. So many people wonder why they can't find a true love. Maybe part of their problem is that they don't take themselves to another level.
Message 172 From: kristel pizon <kedp317@y...> Date: Fri Jul 23, 2004 11:23pm Subject: Re: lasting love ...I am confused about what makes anyone 'the one' are you 'the one' simply because you are sharing your lives and therefore by definition, you are 'the one' or are you the one, because you didn't spend your life together and you got away and you spend your life thinking about 'what could have been'. If we are spending our life with 'the one', then why do so many people who truly love each other seek others after years of marriage? I'm saying maybe what makes them even more 'the one' is the fact that they didn't spend their 20's together getting cynical together, their years apart: solidified their oneness for each other.
Message 176 From: jerseybucsfan <mayda-barry@p...> Date: Sat Jul 24, 2004 0:09am Subject: Re: The uncertainty of whether they had sex (Before Sunrise) ...Remember Celine in the church saying that she always saw herself as an old woman, waiting to die? This can also be the Celine of the future, the old woman looking back. In a way, maybe that was why she was so close with her grandmother, because she saw her as a peer on some level.
Message 181 From: Ali <mittenkg@y...> Date: Sat Jul 24, 2004 4:40 am Subject: Re: [sunriseandsunset] The irony of convincing Celine to get off the train ...but gee, it's moments like that kind of irony in Sunrise that I start thinking of MY ones who got away. Ridiculous, I know, but you can't help thinking that way sometimes when you're single: every other missed opportunity could have been the end-all perfect fella. Or not. Or was. It's pathetic!
Message 184 From: "cosdelli" <cosdelli@h...> Date: Sat Jul 24, 2004 8:18 pm Subject: before midnight ...if I had a dime for every time i referred people to watch before sunrise, I would be a billionaire (ok, maybe a millionaire by now). sunrise was and is a "gem". Sunset is more so, because of the maturity and sincerity of the characters - we grew up with them and we all relate to them. It is a treasure. All credit goes to Delpy, Linklater and Hawke. But I sense that Delpy's words are all over this film. I already have the third film in my mind - 'Before Midnight!'
Message 185 From: "Ashley" <cheerygal1@y...> Date: Sat Jul 24, 2004 9:44 pm Subject: Celine and Jesse in Waking Life ...I loved Linklater's "Waking Life" And enjoyed seeing Celine and Jesse appearing in the movie. I didn't think that there would be a sequel to "Before Sunrise". And I thought Linklater was just placing the characters in "Waking Life" to let the fans know that the two did meet at the train and are happy. But I'm much more excited that he didn't leave it at that and actually gave us another story on the characters.
Message 191 From: "jerseybucsfan" <mayda-barry@p...> Date: Sun Jul 25, 2004 12:04 am Subject: Re: The irony of convincing Celine to get off the train ...Yes, I'm married, but I can honestly say that there were several others that I COULD have married given only slightly different circumstances. I dedicated two poetry anthologies (neither published) to special women, neither of whom I married. What if I had met them a year earlier? A year later? What if that wonderful girl I met when I was a senior in high school had wanted me to go with her, when she went back to Europe? I'm not expressing an overwhelming regret over my life, but given some other circumstances, things could've been dramatically different.
Message 216 From: "Caroline Pohlman" <dorothy_caroline_waniak@y...> Date: Sun Jul 25, 2004 4:39 pm Subject: Hello ...I saw "Before Sunrise" in 1995 on my very, very first date with my now husband - so as you can see, we are very attached to this movie and were elated to hear about the sequel. I saw it yesterday in London and loved it. I love how Linklater doesn't patronize youth and doesn't sugar-coat the 30's angst, either. My only sadness is in knowing that Jesse must now choose between Celine and Henry...
Message 219 From: "tjh2947" <tyler.haney.03@a...> Date: Sun Jul 25, 2004 5:41 pm Subject: Comments and Recommendations ...did you guys notice how similar Jesse's current marriage resembles his parent's own marriage? In "BSunrise" he describes his folks as "two people who didn't like one another too much, who decided to get married and have a kid." They only stayed together for Jesse and his sister's benefit. Now, in "BSunset", Jesse knows he's becoming his father. And, obviously, he's not happy.
Message 220 From: Ali <mittenkg@y...> Date: Sun Jul 25, 2004 8:16 pm Subject: Re: [sunriseandsunset] Comments and Recommendations ...I don't have film recommendations that are thematically similar to S/S, but I go to silent film festivals and many of my favorite romantic comedies have a dreamy, montage-y quality. So do horror flicks, for that matter. Of course in silent films, the comedy tends to be more slapstick than ironic, and the dialogue is next to nil, but if you get a chance to see Harold Lloyd, Mary Pickford or Chaplin on the big screen--particularly with live music--check it out and you'll see what I mean. And with all this montage-talk, I'm always a sucker for that over-the-top and way-romantic spliced-film montage at the end of Cinema Paradiso.
Message 222 From: samantha <samantha@s...> Date: Sun Jul 25, 2004 8:39 pm Subject: Re: [sunriseandsunset] Comments and Recommendations ...The settings and relationships in these two films [BSunset and Lost In Translation] are so different (unlike some critic's reviews) that I couldn't even find a comparison between the two (other than the obvious 'strangers meet in a foreign locale') when I first saw 'Lost In Translation' I found difference upon difference...Both seem to be about: connections are valuable, but in LiT they are extremely transitory: These aren't people who would necessarily connect in any way under different circumstances. They don't talk about anything "real" for most of the time they're together. They silently relate to pain and circumstance. In contrast: Jesse and Celine could find each other at any time and find a connection. Bob and Charlotte... I'm not so sure.
Message 223 From: timelord2029@a... Date: Sun Jul 25, 2004 8:49 pm Subject: Re: [sunriseandsunset] The Notebook In a message dated 25/07/2004 19:09:32 GMT Daylight Time, firstname.lastname@example.org writes: [I have not seen [Lost in Translation] yet...I'll have to check it out. Was it really that good?] ...oh man! It was a total emotional roller coaster. No other film has ever made me cry more than that one. Just take plenty of hankies and prepare yourself.
Message 224 From: darthmaul2112@y... Date: Sun Jul 25, 2004 9:37 pm Subject: Re: lasting love ...I walked out of the theater (and for several hours later) feeling the exact same way you just described. I think love in marriages changes dramatically after several years and "freshness" or "magic" can fade. I think what mostly causes the freshness to disappear or possibly fade, is that we as individuals (especially in the US) just get too caught up in the hustle and bustle of life and don't take the time to "stop and smell the roses". When I really sit down and think about it, my wife has so many beautiful qualities and an honest heart of gold which is so rare in this day and age. I couldn't imagine not wanting to be a part of her little quirks, facial expressions, body language etc. That is love right there, DEEP love...All I know is that the happiest and most satisfied I feel each day is the moment I crawl into bed and my wife is turned to her right and I spoon right up to her. That may sound goofy and gay but it's true. That little moment of time each day makes everything worthwhile. Bottom line: appreciate those little quirks and moments of bliss and you will continue to love them forever.
Message 225 From: "jerseybucsfan" <mayda-barry@p...> Date: Sun Jul 25, 2004 11:25 pm Subject: Re: [sunriseandsunset]lasting love ...I think the key in this, is to love them that much to begin with. A lot of people settle for a particular partner, say it's time to get married, marry for money or for status. The reality is that too many people really don't give that much energy to begin with and thus things never get all that positive. I think it's more than just a subtle appreciation of small characteristics, but also a willingness to love something else. Some love changes, some don't. Clearly Jesse and Celine are different in a lot of ways, but the reality is that they loved each other all these years and are gonna love each other no matter what happens. It's a very conscious commitment to loving. And the magic that we so admire is the DEPTH of the love.
Message 228 From: kristel pizon <kedp317@y...> Date: Sun Jul 25, 2004 11:45 pm Subject: Re: [sunriseandsunset]lasting love ...I think sometimes in reality, the depths of love can be endless but still the reality of life makes it hard to keep that love alive and active. I married out of very passionate love, like I mentioned before. We met (I was 23) we fell instantly in love, married 5 weeks later, and sometimes I think that love would of continued on a different, maybe more deep level, had we been separated for the next 11 years, instead of married. I think that the everyday stresses can kill the magic regardless of the depth of love.
Message 229 From: "hinckley_buzzards" <rtaylor340@a...> Date: Mon Jul 26, 2004 12:15 am Subject: Re: Comments and Recommendations ...about Lost in Translation. I missed it in the theaters but I bought the DVD. Before watching it, I read some reviews that mentioned Before Sunrise, so I got my hopes up and I was disappointed. LIT is visually beautiful and the soundtrack serves it well (I listen to the CD often at work), but LIT was not very verbal, and the conversation is what makes Before Sunrise special. So I think those reviewers who compared LIT to BS were missing the point.
Message 230 From: "jerseybucsfan" <mayda-barry@p...> Date: Mon Jul 26, 2004 12:34 am Subject: Re: [sunriseandsunset]lasting love I believe it was Khalil Gibran that said Let there be spaces in your togetherness. Sometimes I feel like my wife and I get along because we don't get sick of each other. We give each other space. I'm not insinuating that is a problem for you, but I hear ya in terms of everyday problems....finances, errands, kids, work, etc. I think it saps one's creative juices which are critical in romantic love. Nothing works best on auto pilot. In time, my wife came to realize that without energy (without working out, recreational activities) I was a different person. So she gave me more room to be myself and it improved our relationship.
Message 231 From: Danial Monckton <vainer44@y...> Date: Mon Jul 26, 2004 1:45 am Subject: Make time stop(INXS) Anybody remember the song Not Enough Time by INXS? ...I was just listening to this song and it has always reminded me of an old lover I had...And I just thought...What would be the song Jesse would have had for Celine?
Message 233 From: "jerseybucsfan" <mayda-barry@p...> Date: Mon Jul 26, 2004 3:59 am Subject: Trapeze lyrics ...For anybody who wondered.... One of my favorite songs in the first movie and on the soundtrack is Lou Christie's Trapeze. He's got kind of a B-52's sound and almost sounds absurd at times. But there's something about the frantic element in this song that is so appropriate for their romance, particularly in that scene where they're getting the bottle of wine. Only someone young and daring would ask such a thing. One other thought. The last set of lyrics would be very appropriate for what Jesse would've thought when Celine DIDN'T show up on Dec. 16. Anyway....
Message 235 From: tietableguy@y... Date: Mon Jul 26, 2004 4:13 am Subject: Re: [sunriseandsunset]lasting love ...I met my wife in May and married her in December, yet we have a deeper relationship now than when we met. Don't let anyone fool you, a marriage is hard work. Yes the sheer thrill of the newness is gone, but that doesn't mean your relationship is ruined. "All the qualities you fell in love with are still there, they are just familiar now. Find a way to make them new, and keep doing that and I guarantee you won't complain anymore."--the last words are from my grandfather, who was married in 1940 after a month of courtship.
Message 238 From: "edwinpyang" <edwinyang@h...> Date: Mon Jul 26, 2004 12:40 pm Subject: Edge of the Ocean lyrics "Edge Of The Ocean" by Ivy "There's a place I dream about where the sun never goes out. And the sky is deep and blue. Won't you take me there with you..." ...It almost hurts to know this song won't be on the soundtrack when I eventually get a copy. They did a nice job of matching the song's opening strain to the mood of the movie (Sunset) by putting it on the WB site and in the trailer - someone said it played over the closing credits, but I don't remember...I thought the part on the web site was just a good sample of mood music; it's a pleasant shock to know the lyrics as I do now and see the narrative meaning it takes on for Celine and Jesse's reunion. This song, for me at least, has become as synonymous with these beloved movies as Kath Bloom's "Come Here."
Message 239 From: Suncana <suncana76@y...> Date: Mon Jul 26, 2004 12:56 pm Subject: Re: [sunriseandsunset] The Notebook ...Here's my 2 cents on The Notebook: I went to see it last week because a lot of people have mentioned that it's a really good romance and storyline. "A movie like no other". The movie is entertainment Hollywood-style, and I don't believe that it reached the emotional depth of Before Sunset. I walked out of the cinema as the same girl that walked in (short $9.25 CAD)... I saw Before Sunset twice, the last time being July 13th, and I'm still thinking about it and the effect it has had on my own thought processes about life and love. But, that's just me...
Message 240 From: "vainer44" <vainer44@y...> Date: Mon Jul 26, 2004 1:13 pm Subject: 99 members people ...We have only been around for a little more then a week and we are at 100 people.....well 99 but I'm sure we will be there by the end of the day.
Message 241 From: "josephine_1014" <josephine_1014@y...> Date: Mon Jul 26, 2004 1:29 pm Subject: Re: The Notebook ...I have been thinking so much about "Before Sunset"...more so than I ever thought I would.
Message 245 From: "fairmanimation" <fairmanimation@y...> Date: Mon Jul 26, 2004 1:49 pm Subject: Re: Neurotic ...the part where she goes on about how all of her past boyfriends are married but no one has ever proposed to her was a little scary for me because I got the same rant from an ex-girlfriend.
Message 250 From: Suncana <suncana76@y...> Date: Mon Jul 26, 2004 2:50 pm Subject: Re: Neurotic ...I believe that too many of us worry about sounding neurotic or crazy so we end up hiding behind these masks we call "normal". The car scene was the moment of truth.... both finally remove the masks they've been wearing all these years.
Message 251 From: "Jeremy Zorn" <jeremyzorn@c...> Date: Mon Jul 26, 2004 3:00 pm Subject: RE: [sunriseandsunset] Re: Neurotic ...it happens when they are finally in a confined space, as though the physical intimacy has somehow forced them to be more open. They're stuck in the car, and there's no place to hide -- which is, of course, why Celine wants so desperately to get out. I'd posit she'd be fine if they resumed their walk, talking without necessarily looking at one another and able to react to other stimuli (the birds, the river, Notre Dame) when the most immediate grow too raw.
Message 252 From: Suncana <suncana76@y...> Date: Mon Jul 26, 2004 3:24 pm Subject: Re: [sunriseandsunset] Re: The Notebook ...Linklater created two films where, by now, I feel like I know Celine & Jesse because they represent 'me' my friends, my neighbors... These two characters represent the people who don't get to have a happy ending...Or the ones whose road to a happy ending is strewn with a lot more obstacles than the ones shown in The Notebook (movie)...
Message 256 From: kristel pizon <kedp317@y...> Date: Mon Jul 26, 2004 4:37 pm Subject: Re: [sunriseandsunset] Smoking scene ...This scene itself didn't bother me but I find irony in that she is discussing the pollution of the world etc....while polluting her lungs...that struck me...
Message 258 From: Suncana <suncana76@y...> Date: Mon Jul 26, 2004 5:07 pm Subject: Re: [sunriseandsunset] Smoking scene ...I know.... smoking is a self-destructive habit but, considering Celine's Parisian life-style and emotional state, it is understandable that she lights up once in a while... That cafe scene is so Paris!
Message 259 From: "neo_arc" <neo_arc@y...> Date: Mon Jul 26, 2004 5:26 pm Subject: Re: Neurotic ...One thing I found on second viewing was how powerful Jesse's own cathartic scene in the car was. The first time I watched, it was all about Celine for me, but the second time, Jesse's hit me a little harder.
Message 262 From: Jill Lee <jillannalee@y...> Date: Mon Jul 26, 2004 6:57 pm Subject: Re: [sunriseandsunset]lasting love ...After seeing the movie, all I could think of is why can't I have the same connection as Celine and Jesse? Of course I'm fully aware of the fact that it is a movie no matter how many times I've said to everyone in this forum that Sunset seemed to be the most realistic romantic movie ever. But I did hope to have the same thing -- and I did panic because I was afraid that I started to believe in something so ideal that it can't be true. And then somehow, I started to lose hope for my boyfriend and myself... it even drove me to depression that weekend...never wanted to be affected by fictional characters... much less by a movie -- but I guess that's why I joined this group... because I was affected by it... in a personal level.
Message 264 From: "spiderwebbeauty" <spiderwebbeauty@s...> Date: Mon Jul 26, 2004 6:57 pm Subject: Re: smoking ....hope, magic... ...They find each other fascinating and that is what is so touching...they never got over one another and they had that hope. HOPE and Magic. I think this love story touches people on so many levels. It is almost like a fantasy that could come true. It could happen.
Message 267 From: kristel pizon <kedp317@y...> Date: Mon Jul 26, 2004 7:31 pm Subject: Re: [sunriseandsunset] Re: The Notebook ...it wasn't the lost years of opportunity that tempered the happy moments of this film it was what Jesse will have to do in order to be with Celine, the choices he will have to make, the changes that will effect everyone. I too, was incredibly depressed after seeing the film, wondering how one was supposed to follow their heart and true self once they were committed to a relationship, a family. Do we completely give all that up for the sake of the family? ...That was the pain and beauty of this film for me: that Jesse must face that and then go further, however it 's different for a man than a woman, if a man follows his true self and leaves his family it is more accepted-- than for a woman.
Message 271 From: "apriorivirtue" <apriorivirtue@n...> Date: Mon Jul 26, 2004 9:05 pm Subject: The opposite of depression/doubt ...Personally, I am one of the originals who has actually waited with bated breath for Before Sunset for nine years...this movie didn't depressed me, but actually made me be thankful for what I have! ...for me was an intimate portrayal of hope...I felt like Jesse - "My problems are bigger, but I'm more equipped to handle them"...It further highlighted the reality of my current relationship and the deep value it has. For the longest time I subscribed to the notion of love being something that comes in and out of your life. Now this movie has pushed me back into a somewhat scary, yet exhilarating place - maybe my current girlfriend is "the one"?
Message 274 From: Suncana <suncana76@y...> Date: Mon Jul 26, 2004 11:18 pm Subject: Re: lasting love ...connections exist in more forms than one. There are many levels of love and you can love many people in the course of your life. I called off my wedding five years ago because I realized that the love I had for my fianc‰ wasn't the kind of love I should have for the man I'm going to spend the rest of my life with. Looking back, there was always this nagging feeling that there was someone else out there, I was supposed to be with... I experienced it last year and for the first time in my life, I was at peace. The nagging feeling was gone. I was completely "me", without any censorship or hesitation. It was a very liberating feeling. Even though it was just the beginning, it felt as if we knew each other in many lifetimes before...Life is interesting, yet sad...yet hopeful that way...
Message 285 From: "darcy424" <darcy424@y...> Date: Tue Jul 27, 2004 2:25 pm Subject: magic ...Maybe it's because I've traveled around Europe by train like (Jesse & Celine) and have met fantastic people and connected with them. The movie makes me realize how important it is not to settle in life when it comes to a relationship, certainly not a marriage. I wonder how many couples come out of that movie realizing that they are not with their soul mate and that they wish they were? It's exactly what I'm thinking and I know that I'm tired of being in a mediocre relationship and will continue searching for my soul mate.
Message 289 From: "Jennette" <misspig623@y...> Date: Tue Jul 27, 2004 3:21 pm Subject: Re: The Notebook ...I could relate. "What could have been?" --is something we've all wondered at some point in our lives.
Message 290 From: "spiderwebbeauty" <spiderwebbeauty@s...> Date: Tue Jul 27, 2004 3:55 pm Subject: Re: magic ...the scene in the car was the turning point...the truth finally came out because they both new they were running out of time...
Message 294 From: hiroshi upshur <hiroshiupshur@y...> Date: Tue Jul 27, 2004 6:54 pm Subject: Re: [sunriseandsunset] Re: The Notebook ...Love is overcoming obstacles and total commitment to the end. It's a fairy tale, only because to achieve this "love" it takes sticking and working thru the conflicts no matter what. It takes hard work. We as a society seek the easy way. Divorce is easy today... In Before Sunset, though a wonderful film, I see the couple as a love that hasn't been tested yet. "What if Celine had been in a wheelchair? Both films are good as far as I am concerned but I'm a realist and a skeptic in more ways than one. If they were to continue: where would they live ? What about his work in the US? What about his son, his marriage? What about his wife? Will his son accept his new step mom? We don't know these things.
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